Re: [pgsql-advocacy] We need an Advocacy wiki

> ------- Original Message -------
> From: "Joshua D. Drake" <jd(at)commandprompt(dot)com>
> To: Dave Page <dpage(at)postgresql(dot)org>
> Sent: 04/08/07, 22:14:05
> Subject: Re: [pgsql-advocacy] [pgsql-www] We need an Advocacy wiki
>
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> Dave Page wrote:
>
> >> A. Understand CVS
> >> B. Understand HTML
> >> C. Understand patch
> >
> > Rubbish. You send the text to -www.
> >
>
> Really? O.k. I need a page where I and Berkus can dynamically manage
> sponsors. Where do I send the requirements to get that done?
>

You don't 'manage' sponsors on the website, if only because much of the detail on any givesponsor should be confidential. If you want to list them, forward the details and one of us will update the sponsors page.

/D

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Dave Page wrote:
>

>>>> A. Understand CVS
>>>> B. Understand HTML
>>>> C. Understand patch
>>> Rubbish. You send the text to -www.
>>>
>> Really? O.k. I need a page where I and Berkus can dynamically manage
>> sponsors. Where do I send the requirements to get that done?
>>
>
> You don't 'manage' sponsors on the website, if only because much of the detail on any givesponsor should be confidential. If you want to list them, forward the details and one of us will update the sponsors page.

And you think, that I don't recognize the *exact* level of what needs to
be confidential or that by chance I would not communicate in discrete
and finite detail of what a potential or existing sponsor would wish to
be known?

We do indeed need sponsor management, I can either do it the hard way,
which is to draw up a new page every time or I can do it the easy way in
which to have a dynamic interface that is easy to manage.

The hard way, is exactly why we have neglected our partners (sponsors)
to date, because of time, and resources. It is also the exact same
reason that Berkus has *also* not provided a new sponsors page.

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake

>
> /D
>

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Joshua D. Drake wrote:
> Dave Page wrote:
>>> Really? O.k. I need a page where I and Berkus can dynamically manage
>>> sponsors. Where do I send the requirements to get that done?
>>>
>> You don't 'manage' sponsors on the website, if only because much of the detail on any givesponsor should be confidential. If you want to list them, forward the details and one of us will update the sponsors page.
>
> And you think, that I don't recognize the *exact* level of what needs to
> be confidential or that by chance I would not communicate in discrete
> and finite detail of what a potential or existing sponsor would wish to
> be known?
>
> We do indeed need sponsor management, I can either do it the hard way,
> which is to draw up a new page every time or I can do it the easy way in
> which to have a dynamic interface that is easy to manage.
>
> The hard way, is exactly why we have neglected our partners (sponsors)
> to date, because of time, and resources. It is also the exact same
> reason that Berkus has *also* not provided a new sponsors page.

Ok. I have to admit I don't follow you - what exactly is your need? To
be able to dynamically handle *public* information about sponsors, or to
be bale to handle *confidential* information about them?

If you're talking about the public stuff, then spec up exactly what you
need and post it to -www. Or even better, have one of your php guys
write a patch ;-) But I can't imagine it shouldn't be insanely
difficult, so probably someone else can do it for you.

If you're talking about private stuff, why do you want it on the main
website? I'm (as you will know to the point of sickness by now) all for
a single unified web presence *to the end users*. But this kind of
confidential information that really only a few people should have
access to (and not even the whole "dev community = anybody signed up on
-hackers" like the wiki) can live elsewhere. Like we've done with pmt.
So if that's what's needed, I'd suggest either using pmt or setting up
something similar to pmt - depending on exactly who should have access
to the information.

You can't very well stick this confidential information on a wiki
either, as long as it's open for public reader, can you?

So my summary is:
* Information directed at end users and "outsiders" - website
* Information directed only at the active community - wiki
* Confidential information requiring login for both read and write -
separate completely

//Magnus

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Magnus Hagander wrote:
> Joshua D. Drake wrote:
>> Dave Page wrote:

>> The hard way, is exactly why we have neglected our partners (sponsors)
>> to date, because of time, and resources. It is also the exact same
>> reason that Berkus has *also* not provided a new sponsors page.
>
> Ok. I have to admit I don't follow you - what exactly is your need? To
> be able to dynamically handle *public* information about sponsors, or to
> be bale to handle *confidential* information about them?

Let's take this to another thread. After arguing with dpage about this I
realize we might be talking past each other.

>
> If you're talking about the public stuff, then spec up exactly what you
> need and post it to -www. Or even better, have one of your php guys
> write a patch ;-) But I can't imagine it shouldn't be insanely
> difficult, so probably someone else can do it for you.
>

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=== The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
http://www.commandprompt.com/

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Joshua D. Drake wrote:
> Magnus Hagander wrote:
>> Joshua D. Drake wrote:
>>> Dave Page wrote:
>
>>> The hard way, is exactly why we have neglected our partners (sponsors)
>>> to date, because of time, and resources. It is also the exact same
>>> reason that Berkus has *also* not provided a new sponsors page.
>> Ok. I have to admit I don't follow you - what exactly is your need? To
>> be able to dynamically handle *public* information about sponsors, or to
>> be bale to handle *confidential* information about them?
>
> Let's take this to another thread. After arguing with dpage about this I
> realize we might be talking past each other.

Wouldn't be the first time, and I doubt it'll be the last. :-)

/D

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Dave Page wrote:
> Joshua D. Drake wrote:
>> Magnus Hagander wrote:
>>> Joshua D. Drake wrote:
>>>> Dave Page wrote:
>>>> The hard way, is exactly why we have neglected our partners (sponsors)
>>>> to date, because of time, and resources. It is also the exact same
>>>> reason that Berkus has *also* not provided a new sponsors page.
>>> Ok. I have to admit I don't follow you - what exactly is your need? To
>>> be able to dynamically handle *public* information about sponsors, or to
>>> be bale to handle *confidential* information about them?
>> Let's take this to another thread. After arguing with dpage about this I
>> realize we might be talking past each other.
>
> Wouldn't be the first time, and I doubt it'll be the last. :-)

We could pray and hope but then reality would crush us ;)

Joshua D. Drake

>
> /D
>
> ---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
> TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
>

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Josh,

> > We do indeed need sponsor management, I can either do it the hard way,
> > which is to draw up a new page every time or I can do it the easy way in
> > which to have a dynamic interface that is easy to manage.

Be fair. The website formatting is NOT what's holding up our ability to have
a sponsor page. Having up-to-date sponsor data (my fault) and a script to
generate sponsor listings (your fault) is. The XHTML for the page is quite
simple, the only moderately complex part is uploading sponsor logo images.

--
Josh Berkus
PostgreSQL @ Sun
San Francisco

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Josh Berkus wrote:
> Josh,
>
>>> We do indeed need sponsor management, I can either do it the hard way,
>>> which is to draw up a new page every time or I can do it the easy way in
>>> which to have a dynamic interface that is easy to manage.
>
> Be fair. The website formatting is NOT what's holding up our ability to have
> a sponsor page. Having up-to-date sponsor data (my fault) and a script to
> generate sponsor listings (your fault) is. The XHTML for the page is quite
> simple, the only moderately complex part is uploading sponsor logo images.

Josh I am being fair, the point was, we need sponsor management. We
don't have that right now. If you read the *entire* thread you will see
where it all came from.

I have already discussed with Magnus the technological requirements and
we are both in agreement that it won't be difficult at all to get up in
a manner that is dynamically manageable.

Joshua D. Drake

- --

=== The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
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