Re: Merchandising, merchandising.. on the postgresql.eu site

Hi,

I've noticed that there's been a merchandise section on the European
Postgres site for a short while. Does anyone know when we can expect
to see this up and running?

Thanks

Thom

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:31 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I've noticed that there's been a merchandise section on the European
> Postgres site for a short while.  Does anyone know when we can expect
> to see this up and running?

How long do you think it'll take you to build a store?

:-p

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

2009/11/11 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:31 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I've noticed that there's been a merchandise section on the European
>> Postgres site for a short while.  Does anyone know when we can expect
>> to see this up and running?
>
> How long do you think it'll take you to build a store?
>
> :-p
>

Ah, I see. So it's the case that we don't have any online store
written then? I couldn't find any discussion of this anywhere,
including the wiki, so wasn't sure what the status of it was.

Is it that there's no-one to produce the web store software then?
(says Thom the web developer)

Thom

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:50 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:

> Ah, I see.  So it's the case that we don't have any online store
> written then?  I couldn't find any discussion of this anywhere,
> including the wiki, so wasn't sure what the status of it was.
>
> Is it that there's no-one to produce the web store software then?
> (says Thom the web developer)

Well I'm not sure we necessarily want to write our own store - it may
be easiest just to use cafepress or a similar service which can handle
everything for us.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

2009/11/11 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:50 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> Ah, I see.  So it's the case that we don't have any online store
>> written then?  I couldn't find any discussion of this anywhere,
>> including the wiki, so wasn't sure what the status of it was.
>>
>> Is it that there's no-one to produce the web store software then?
>> (says Thom the web developer)
>
> Well I'm not sure we necessarily want to write our own store - it may
> be easiest just to use cafepress or a similar service which can handle
> everything for us.
>

Something like Cafepress sure would be the easier route.... so going
back a bit, is there just no-one to organise it, or just lack or stuff
to sell at the moment etc?

Thom

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:59 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:

> Something like Cafepress sure would be the easier route.... so going
> back a bit, is there just no-one to organise it, or just lack or stuff
> to sell at the moment etc?

Mainly just noone stepped up to the task yet I think. I certainly have
no objection if you want to look into the options, and potentially set
something up though.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/11 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:50 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ah, I see.  So it's the case that we don't have any online store
>>> written then?  I couldn't find any discussion of this anywhere,
>>> including the wiki, so wasn't sure what the status of it was.
>>>
>>> Is it that there's no-one to produce the web store software then?
>>> (says Thom the web developer)
>>
>> Well I'm not sure we necessarily want to write our own store - it may
>> be easiest just to use cafepress or a similar service which can handle
>> everything for us.
>>
>
> Something like Cafepress sure would be the easier route.... so going
> back a bit, is there just no-one to organise it, or just lack or stuff
> to sell at the moment etc?

Don't forget Zazzle! :)

-selena

--
http://chesnok.com/daily - me
http://endpoint.com - work

On Nov 11, 2009, at 10:06 AM, Dave Page wrote:

> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:59 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> wrote:
>
>> Something like Cafepress sure would be the easier route.... so going
>> back a bit, is there just no-one to organise it, or just lack or
>> stuff
>> to sell at the moment etc?
>
> Mainly just noone stepped up to the task yet I think. I certainly have
> no objection if you want to look into the options, and potentially set
> something up though.
>
>
> --
> Dave Page
> EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

I am not sure how much of a pre-built store will be required to sell
merchandise (AFAIK cafepress is just t-shirts), but I know with
Shopify (http://www.shopify.com/) you can list whatever items you want
to sell. I say this because I know the elephant plushy could be the
hot-ticket item for the holidays this year :-)

Jonathan

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 3:24 PM, Jonathan S. Katz
<jonathan(dot)katz(at)excoventures(dot)com> wrote:

> I am not sure how much of a pre-built store will be required to sell
> merchandise (AFAIK cafepress is just t-shirts), but I know with Shopify
> (http://www.shopify.com/) you can list whatever items you want to sell.  I
> say this because I know the elephant plushy could be the hot-ticket item for
> the holidays this year :-)

Cafepress does all manner of goods -
http://www.cafepress.com/cp/info/sell/index.aspx?area=products&page=products,
as do Zazzle.

The beauty of them over Shopify is that they handle everything for you
- manufacture, sale and shipping. With Shopify, we'd need to supply
and ship our own stock - great for shifting a few plushys - not so
good for dealing with orders for shirts or pins every day.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

2009/11/11 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 3:24 PM, Jonathan S. Katz
> <jonathan(dot)katz(at)excoventures(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> I am not sure how much of a pre-built store will be required to sell
>> merchandise (AFAIK cafepress is just t-shirts), but I know with Shopify
>> (http://www.shopify.com/) you can list whatever items you want to sell.  I
>> say this because I know the elephant plushy could be the hot-ticket item for
>> the holidays this year :-)
>
> Cafepress does all manner of goods -
> http://www.cafepress.com/cp/info/sell/index.aspx?area=products&page=products,
> as do Zazzle.
>
> The beauty of them over Shopify is that they handle everything for you
> - manufacture, sale and shipping. With Shopify, we'd need to supply
> and ship our own stock - great for shifting a few plushys - not so
> good for dealing with orders for shirts or pins every day.
>
So assuming there's a decision made on where to sell it, and we get an
account set up, who manages what merchandise is for sale? I've heard
things about plush elephants (or PostgreSQLephants as I call them),
mugs, t-shirts etc, but is there a list? And who orders them etc?
I'd be happy to be given a job to do here, although I'm not quite sure
what.

Thom

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 3:55 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:

> So assuming there's a decision made on where to sell it, and we get an
> account set up, who manages what merchandise is for sale?  I've heard
> things about plush elephants (or PostgreSQLephants as I call them),
> mugs, t-shirts etc, but is there a list?  And who orders them etc?
> I'd be happy to be given a job to do here, although I'm not quite sure
> what.

Ads has managed past orders of elephants and mugs for selling at shows
and conferences, however, if we're going to open an online store, my
view is that we should use somewhere like cafepress or zazzle where we
can make full use of their inventory, without having to produce any
stock of our own (dunno about zazzle, but with cafepress, you
basically just choose an item, upload the image to print on it, and
set the price). It should be entirely separate from the stock we keep
ourselves for shows (in fact, having to come to a show to get an
elephant has a certain appeal to it).

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 17:06, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 3:55 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> So assuming there's a decision made on where to sell it, and we get an
>> account set up, who manages what merchandise is for sale?  I've heard
>> things about plush elephants (or PostgreSQLephants as I call them),
>> mugs, t-shirts etc, but is there a list?  And who orders them etc?
>> I'd be happy to be given a job to do here, although I'm not quite sure
>> what.
>
> Ads has managed past orders of elephants and mugs for selling at shows
> and conferences, however, if we're going to open an online store, my
> view is that we should use somewhere like cafepress or zazzle where we
> can make full use of their inventory, without having to produce any
> stock of our own (dunno about zazzle, but with cafepress, you
> basically just choose an item, upload the image to print on it, and
> set the price). It should be entirely separate from the stock we keep
> ourselves for shows (in fact, having to come to a show to get an
> elephant has a certain appeal to it).

Yes, we are definitely going to use something like that. No way we
want to maintain the whole hting ourselves, particularly shipping etc.

IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
more euro-centric.

Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
so it may be locked to the language)

I think what's needed at first is to define what we want, then create
a nice comparison matrix (*cough*wiki*cough*) showing our different
options. Both wrt what they can sell, how it's set up, and how we can
integrate it with our site if we want to.

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:

> IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
> more euro-centric.
>
> Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
> Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
> investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
> so it may be locked to the language)

Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.

> I think what's needed at first is to define what we want, then create
> a nice comparison matrix (*cough*wiki*cough*) showing our different
> options. Both wrt what they can sell, how it's set up, and how we can
> integrate it with our site if we want to.

I think the 'what' is easy:

Manufacture, order handling, payment processing and shipping handled for us.
Possible stock items to include:
T-Shirts
Mugs
Mouse mats
Other assorted goodies

Anything else?

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:25:00PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
>
> > IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
> > more euro-centric.
> >
> > Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
> > Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
> > investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
> > so it may be locked to the language)
>
> Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.

Yay!

> > I think what's needed at first is to define what we want, then
> > create a nice comparison matrix (*cough*wiki*cough*) showing our
> > different options. Both wrt what they can sell, how it's set up,
> > and how we can integrate it with our site if we want to.
>
> I think the 'what' is easy:
>
> Manufacture, order handling, payment processing and shipping handled
> for us. Possible stock items to include:
> T-Shirts
> Mugs
> Mouse mats
> Other assorted goodies
>
> Anything else?

Depending on the price, Oxford shirts and bigger USB keys. Those
PG.FR shirts are fantastic :)

Cheers,
David.
--
David Fetter <david(at)fetter(dot)org> http://fetter.org/
Phone: +1 415 235 3778 AIM: dfetter666 Yahoo!: dfetter
Skype: davidfetter XMPP: david(dot)fetter(at)gmail(dot)com
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Remember to vote!
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On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 18:11, David Fetter <david(at)fetter(dot)org> wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:25:00PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
>>
>> > IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
>> > more euro-centric.
>> >
>> > Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
>> > Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
>> > investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
>> > so it may be locked to the language)
>>
>> Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.
>
> Yay!

AFAICS, cafepress has an UK operations with is certainly European but
not Euro. The point being the currency, because that will make life a
lot easier for most buyers. I believe spreadshirts does both EUR and
UKP. Heck, they even do SEK :-)

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

On 11/11/09, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 18:11, David Fetter <david(at)fetter(dot)org> wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:25:00PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
>>> > more euro-centric.
>>> >
>>> > Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
>>> > Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
>>> > investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
>>> > so it may be locked to the language)
>>>
>>> Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.
>>
>> Yay!
>
> AFAICS, cafepress has an UK operations with is certainly European but
> not Euro. The point being the currency, because that will make life a
> lot easier for most buyers. I believe spreadshirts does both EUR and
> UKP. Heck, they even do SEK :-)

cafepress's homepage says they take Euros. The downside with
spreadshirt is that they only do clothes (afaics). Cafepress (and i
think Zazzle) also do things like mugs, clocks, cards, magnets etc

>
> --
> Sent via pgeu-general mailing list (pgeu-general(at)postgresql(dot)org)
> To make changes to your subscription:
> http://www.postgresql.org/mailpref/pgeu-general
>

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 19:01, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> On 11/11/09, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 18:11, David Fetter <david(at)fetter(dot)org> wrote:
>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:25:00PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
>>>> > more euro-centric.
>>>> >
>>>> > Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
>>>> > Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
>>>> > investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
>>>> > so it may be locked to the language)
>>>>
>>>> Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.
>>>
>>> Yay!
>>
>> AFAICS, cafepress has an UK operations with is certainly European but
>> not Euro. The point being the currency, because that will make life a
>> lot easier for most buyers. I believe spreadshirts does both EUR and
>> UKP. Heck, they even do SEK :-)
>
> cafepress's homepage says they take Euros. The downside with
> spreadshirt is that they only do clothes (afaics). Cafepress (and i
> think Zazzle) also do things like mugs, clocks, cards, magnets etc

They do a lot more than that, but not necessarily everything we'll
want. Which is why we need that comparison matrix :-)

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/11 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 18:11, David Fetter <david(at)fetter(dot)org> wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:25:00PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
>>>
>>> > IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
>>> > more euro-centric.
>>> >
>>> > Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
>>> > Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
>>> > investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
>>> > so it may be locked to the language)
>>>
>>> Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.
>>
>> Yay!
>
> AFAICS, cafepress has an UK operations with is certainly European but
> not Euro. The point being the currency, because that will make life a
> lot easier for most buyers. I believe spreadshirts does both EUR and
> UKP. Heck, they even do SEK :-)
>

Looks like Zazzle puts the UK and the rest of Europe on equal footing
with regards to shipping:
http://zazzle.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/519/kw/Product%20Information/r_id/166

Thom

Magnus Hagander wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 18:11, David Fetter <david(at)fetter(dot)org> wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:25:00PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> IIRC the thing we looked closest at was spreadshirt, because they are
>>>> more euro-centric.
>>>>
>>>> Cafepress and zazzle aren't available in Euro-countries, AFAIK.
>>>> Actually, it looks like Zazzle may now be, so they could be worth
>>>> investigating. (Right now whenever I try it it just turns into German,
>>>> so it may be locked to the language)
>>> Cafepress seems to have European operations now as well.
>> Yay!
>
> AFAICS, cafepress has an UK operations with is certainly European but
> not Euro. The point being the currency, because that will make life a
> lot easier for most buyers. I believe spreadshirts does both EUR and
> UKP. Heck, they even do SEK :-)

Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
(about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was
by cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid
to your bank account.
Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
spreadshirt.

--
Tommy Gildseth

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Tommy Gildseth
<tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no> wrote:

> Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
> (about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was by
> cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid to
> your bank account.
> Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
> spreadshirt.

Those are definitely both downsides - though frankly, cheques should
not be a problem for our French bank account!

Anyone have any experience with Zazzle, or have any other suggestions?

Thom; are you going to summarise the options on the wiki so we can
make an informed decision? I'm conscious that I press-ganged you into
this, but unless you say you're definitely not going to work on it,
I'll assume you are :-p

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 09:54, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Tommy Gildseth
> <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no> wrote:
>
>> Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
>> (about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was by
>> cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid to
>> your bank account.
>> Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
>> spreadshirt.
>
> Those are definitely both downsides - though frankly, cheques should
> not be a problem for our French bank account!

Not sure if that was a joke, but just to be clear - cheques *are* a
problem, and we don't want to tie ourselves down to a service that
hasn't left the 80ies unless we absolutely have to. It's not a
dealbreaker, but it's a serious issue.

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 9:02 AM, Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 09:54, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Tommy Gildseth
>> <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no> wrote:
>>
>>> Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
>>> (about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was by
>>> cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid to
>>> your bank account.
>>> Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
>>> spreadshirt.
>>
>> Those are definitely both downsides - though frankly, cheques should
>> not be a problem for our French bank account!
>
> Not sure if that was a joke, but just to be clear - cheques *are* a
> problem, and we don't want to tie ourselves down to a service that
> hasn't left the 80ies unless we absolutely have to. It's not a
> dealbreaker, but it's a serious issue.

That was half joke, half serious (based on previous discussions you, I
and others have had on the subject). Whether you consider them
old-fashioned or not, cheques are still widely used in some countries,
and do have some advantages over other payment methods.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

Le mercredi 11 novembre 2009 16:08:00, Selena Deckelmann a écrit :
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > 2009/11/11 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> >> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 2:50 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> >>> Ah, I see. So it's the case that we don't have any online store
> >>> written then? I couldn't find any discussion of this anywhere,
> >>> including the wiki, so wasn't sure what the status of it was.
> >>>
> >>> Is it that there's no-one to produce the web store software then?
> >>> (says Thom the web developer)
> >>
> >> Well I'm not sure we necessarily want to write our own store - it may
> >> be easiest just to use cafepress or a similar service which can handle
> >> everything for us.
> >
> > Something like Cafepress sure would be the easier route.... so going
> > back a bit, is there just no-one to organise it, or just lack or stuff
> > to sell at the moment etc?
>
> Don't forget Zazzle! :)
>
> -selena
>

I am fine with the idea, more : I like it :)

I have just one main requirement if the shop make the product itself :
garantee that products are not made by children. (ideally, a tracable
product)

--
Cédric Villemain
Administrateur de Base de Données
Cel: +33 (0)6 74 15 56 53
http://dalibo.com - http://dalibo.org

2009/11/12 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Tommy Gildseth
> <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no> wrote:
>
>> Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
>> (about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was by
>> cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid to
>> your bank account.
>> Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
>> spreadshirt.
>
> Those are definitely both downsides - though frankly, cheques should
> not be a problem for our French bank account!
>
> Anyone have any experience with Zazzle, or have any other suggestions?
>
> Thom; are you going to summarise the options on the wiki so we can
> make an informed decision? I'm conscious that I press-ganged you into
> this, but unless you say you're definitely not going to work on it,
> I'll assume you are :-p
>

I'd be happy to if someone can give me access to it. I was looking
into this stuff last night, comparing Cafepress, Zazzle and
Spreadshirt products and shipping prices. I'll do some more research
into people's experiences with these companies, and I'll put something
together.

Thom

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 9:58 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:

> I'd be happy to if someone can give me access to it.

Cool, thanks. wiki.postgresql.eu should accept your community login,
which I assume you have as you registered for pgday :-). Yelp, if you
have any problems.

> I was looking
> into this stuff last night, comparing Cafepress, Zazzle and
> Spreadshirt products and shipping prices.  I'll do some more research
> into people's experiences with these companies, and I'll put something
> together.

Thanks!

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

Dave Page wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 9:58 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>
>
>> I'd be happy to if someone can give me access to it.
>>
>
> Cool, thanks. wiki.postgresql.eu should accept your community login,
> which I assume you have as you registered for pgday :-). Yelp, if you
> have any problems.
>

this is a wrong assumption for people with ugly long names :).

according to some law some stupid idiot has made our names had to be in
the company name ... thus "Cybertec Schönig & Schönig GmbH" :).
so, thanks to some law maker we killed magnus' python script + data
structure.
i will try to find the guy who caused. we should invoice this problem to
the lawmaker ...
suicides are accepted as payments from their side :).

many thanks,

hans

--
Cybertec Schoenig & Schoenig GmbH
Reyergasse 9 / 2
A-2700 Wiener Neustadt
Web: www.postgresql-support.de

Hello all,

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:06:18PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 3:55 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>
> > So assuming there's a decision made on where to sell it, and we get an
> > account set up, who manages what merchandise is for sale?  I've heard
> > things about plush elephants (or PostgreSQLephants as I call them),
> > mugs, t-shirts etc, but is there a list?  And who orders them etc?
> > I'd be happy to be given a job to do here, although I'm not quite sure
> > what.
>
> Ads has managed past orders of elephants and mugs for selling at shows
> and conferences,

Yes, that's true.

> however, if we're going to open an online store, my view is that we
> should use somewhere like cafepress or zazzle where we can make full
> use of their inventory, without having to produce any stock of our own

Hmm, so we are stuck to their inventory? What about plush elephants?
What about a new mug design? What about shirts for the kids? ;-)

We should at least be able to supply some items.

> It should be entirely separate from the stock we keep
> ourselves for shows (in fact, having to come to a show to get an
> elephant has a certain appeal to it).

Not everyone will come over to good old europe just to get one of this
nifty elephants :-(

But the elephants are not the big deal, i'm all open for having an
online shop, although i could not find the time in the past to deal with
this issue. I tried spreadshirt once but this wasn't a big success.

Bye

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project

PGDay.eu 2009 in Paris, Nov. 6/7, http://www.pgday.eu/

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 10:49 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:

> Hmm, so we are stuck to their inventory? What about plush elephants?
> What about a new mug design? What about shirts for the kids? ;-)
>
> We should at least be able to supply some items.

From what I've seen, we either have all the stock provided for us, or
none of it. So if we wanted to have someone else handle all the
logistics etc for supplying T-shirts online *and* sell plushys, we'd
need two shop fronts.

My view is that that is impractical, and that we should use a full
service site for our online merchandise, and keep the special/custom
stuff for sale at conferences etc. It's not perfect, but it seems like
a good compromise to me.

Of course, I'd be happy to be proven wrong, if we can find somewhere
that offers both options.

> Not everyone will come over to good old europe just to get one of this
> nifty elephants :-(

No, but it will give them an air of exclusivity :-)

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

Ciao,

2009/11/12 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> My view is that that is impractical, and that we should use a full
> service site for our online merchandise, and keep the special/custom
> stuff for sale at conferences etc. It's not perfect, but it seems like
> a good compromise to me.

I agree with you Dave, completely. Let's not forget we do volunteering
here. The logistics aspect of this requires time. We must rely on a
professional partner for this, and possibly get a commission from
every sale (I expect that a percentage of their sells would go back to
the community - at least when a few years ago I asked ThinkGeek that's
what they were doing).

And yes, we should continue with bulk buying for our conferences as it
is an important source of incomes and helps the group sustainability.

Ciao,
Gabriele

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 11:55, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 10:49 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>
>> Hmm, so we are stuck to their inventory? What about plush elephants?
>> What about a new mug design? What about shirts for the kids? ;-)
>>
>> We should at least be able to supply some items.
>
> From what I've seen, we either have all the stock provided for us, or
> none of it. So if we wanted to have someone else handle all the
> logistics etc for supplying T-shirts online *and* sell plushys, we'd
> need two shop fronts.

Do they have APIs so we could do a frontend and use them for just
parts of it? Or do they require the hwole thing to be there? I can
totally understand that they don't let us sell other things through
their site, but they might allow our site to use theirs or something?

> My view is that that is impractical, and that we should use a full
> service site for our online merchandise, and keep the special/custom
> stuff for sale at conferences etc. It's not perfect, but it seems like
> a good compromise to me.

+1.

We really *can't* deal with the logistics. There is no way in we have
the manpower to do that. And if we did, it can be better spent on
something else.

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

On 12/11/2009 09:02, Magnus Hagander wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 09:54, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Tommy Gildseth
>> <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no> wrote:
>>
>>> Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
>>> (about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was by
>>> cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid to
>>> your bank account.
>>> Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
>>> spreadshirt.
>> Those are definitely both downsides - though frankly, cheques should
>> not be a problem for our French bank account!
>
> Not sure if that was a joke, but just to be clear - cheques *are* a
> problem, and we don't want to tie ourselves down to a service that
> hasn't left the 80ies unless we absolutely have to. It's not a
> dealbreaker, but it's a serious issue.

They're certainly a problem (or at least expensive) if you're trying to
cash a cheque written in another country, even within the Euro zone.

Ray.

--
Raymond O'Donnell :: Galway :: Ireland
rod(at)iol(dot)ie

2009/11/12 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 7:07 AM, Tommy Gildseth
> <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no> wrote:
>
>> Another major (imo) downside to cafepress, is that last time I used them
>> (about a year ago), the only way of getting your earnings paid out, was by
>> cheque, or re-using credits on cafepress. No option of paypal or paid to
>> your bank account.
>> Also, the quality of cafepress' printing is noticeably poorer than f.ex
>> spreadshirt.
>
> Those are definitely both downsides - though frankly, cheques should
> not be a problem for our French bank account!
>
> Anyone have any experience with Zazzle, or have any other suggestions?
>
> Thom; are you going to summarise the options on the wiki so we can
> make an informed decision? I'm conscious that I press-ganged you into
> this, but unless you say you're definitely not going to work on it,
> I'll assume you are :-p
>
> --
> Dave Page
> EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
>

Okay, I've written some initial findings on the wiki:
http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise

Cafepress really doesn't come out that good.

Thom

On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 8:29 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:

> Okay, I've written some initial findings on the wiki:
> http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise

Nice. Love the use of pro, con and meh :-)

> Cafepress really doesn't come out that good.

No. Spreadshirt does look good, but the one thing that marks them down
for me is their lack of non-clothing items. All I could see in a quick
glance of your list was mug, sticker and umbrella. Basic stuff like
mouse mats is missing, as well as some of the other more unusual, yet
interesting swag.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

2009/11/13 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
> No. Spreadshirt does look good, but the one thing that marks them down
> for me is their lack of non-clothing items. All I could see in a quick
> glance of your list was mug, sticker and umbrella. Basic stuff like
> mouse mats is missing, as well as some of the other more unusual, yet
> interesting swag.
>

Yes, Spreadshirt don't seem to list such things on their site. I've
fired an email their way to see if they'll also do items such as
mousemats, calendars, clocks, notepads, postcards and keychains. You
never know, maybe they do and just haven't listed it.

Thom

2009/11/13 Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>:
> 2009/11/13 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
>> No. Spreadshirt does look good, but the one thing that marks them down
>> for me is their lack of non-clothing items. All I could see in a quick
>> glance of your list was mug, sticker and umbrella. Basic stuff like
>> mouse mats is missing, as well as some of the other more unusual, yet
>> interesting swag.
>>
>
> Yes, Spreadshirt don't seem to list such things on their site.  I've
> fired an email their way to see if they'll also do items such as
> mousemats, calendars, clocks, notepads, postcards and keychains.  You
> never know, maybe they do and just haven't listed it.
>
> Thom
>

I'm still in the process of exchanging emails with Spreadshirt about
items they don't list on their site. I'm now talking to their bulk
orders department as apparently they might be able to produce products
not listed in their range yet. I've asked if there's an option to buy
in bulk in advance, but still have them manage the stock and dispatch.

If it turns out they can't provide the other kinds of items at this
time, is that a deal-breaker? It would be a shame as I get the
feeling they're the best of the 3 I've looked at, particularly because
of their pan-European-friendly services.

Thom

On Monday, November 16, 2009, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/13 Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>:
>> 2009/11/13 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>:
>>> No. Spreadshirt does look good, but the one thing that marks them down
>>> for me is their lack of non-clothing items. All I could see in a quick
>>> glance of your list was mug, sticker and umbrella. Basic stuff like
>>> mouse mats is missing, as well as some of the other more unusual, yet
>>> interesting swag.
>>>
>>
>> Yes, Spreadshirt don't seem to list such things on their site.  I've
>> fired an email their way to see if they'll also do items such as
>> mousemats, calendars, clocks, notepads, postcards and keychains.  You
>> never know, maybe they do and just haven't listed it.
>>
>> Thom
>>
>
> I'm still in the process of exchanging emails with Spreadshirt about
> items they don't list on their site.  I'm now talking to their bulk
> orders department as apparently they might be able to produce products
> not listed in their range yet.  I've asked if there's an option to buy
> in bulk in advance, but still have them manage the stock and dispatch.
>
> If it turns out they can't provide the other kinds of items at this
> time, is that a deal-breaker?  It would be a shame as I get the
> feeling they're the best of the 3 I've looked at, particularly because
> of their pan-European-friendly services.

I wouldn't consider it a deal breaker. Negative point, yes. But if the
positives outweigh it, we can find a way. The first being that things
we need in bulk for conference etc we can easily get elsewhere...

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/16 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>:
> On Monday, November 16, 2009, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>>
>> If it turns out they can't provide the other kinds of items at this
>> time, is that a deal-breaker?  It would be a shame as I get the
>> feeling they're the best of the 3 I've looked at, particularly because
>> of their pan-European-friendly services.
>
> I wouldn't consider it a deal breaker. Negative point, yes. But if the
> positives outweigh it, we can find a way. The first being that things
> we need in bulk for conference etc we can easily get elsewhere...
>

Don't worry, I've assumed that stuff for conferences would be
separately sourced anyway. The options I'm looking into are purely
with the aim of providing an ad-hoc purchase mechanism for
individuals. The bulk buying I referred to was buying in advance so
that Spreadshirt would have stock of ours to sell as it's not
something they can provide on an ad-hoc basis.

But as for mouse mats, I personally haven't used one in years now, not
since I've been using optical mice. Would it really be that popular?

Thom

On 11/16/09, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/16 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>:
>> On Monday, November 16, 2009, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>>>
>>> If it turns out they can't provide the other kinds of items at this
>>> time, is that a deal-breaker? It would be a shame as I get the
>>> feeling they're the best of the 3 I've looked at, particularly because
>>> of their pan-European-friendly services.
>>
>> I wouldn't consider it a deal breaker. Negative point, yes. But if the
>> positives outweigh it, we can find a way. The first being that things
>> we need in bulk for conference etc we can easily get elsewhere...
>>
>
> Don't worry, I've assumed that stuff for conferences would be
> separately sourced anyway. The options I'm looking into are purely
> with the aim of providing an ad-hoc purchase mechanism for
> individuals. The bulk buying I referred to was buying in advance so
> that Spreadshirt would have stock of ours to sell as it's not
> something they can provide on an ad-hoc basis.
>
> But as for mouse mats, I personally haven't used one in years now, not
> since I've been using optical mice. Would it really be that popular?

Can't say, but i use one primarily for the integrated wrist rest.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On 16/11/2009 11:30, Thom Brown wrote:

> But as for mouse mats, I personally haven't used one in years now, not
> since I've been using optical mice. Would it really be that popular?

I can only speak for myself, but I find that there are quite a few
surfaces on which optical mice don't work - shiny surfaces mostly.

Ray.

--
Raymond O'Donnell :: Galway :: Ireland
rod(at)iol(dot)ie

2009/11/16 Raymond O'Donnell <rod(at)iol(dot)ie>:
> On 16/11/2009 11:30, Thom Brown wrote:
>
>> But as for mouse mats, I personally haven't used one in years now, not
>> since I've been using optical mice.  Would it really be that popular?
>
> I can only speak for myself, but I find that there are quite a few
> surfaces on which optical mice don't work - shiny surfaces mostly.
>
> Ray.
>
> --
> Raymond O'Donnell :: Galway :: Ireland
> rod(at)iol(dot)ie
>

Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
volumes. Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular items?
If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
accommodate us.

In any case, where do we go from here? Is someone able to make a
decision at this point, or is more information required? Do you want
me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some if
so), or find out any more information before deciding?

Thanks

Thom

On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
> they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
> volumes.  Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular items?
> If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
> accommodate us.

I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item might be.

> In any case, where do we go from here?  Is someone able to make a
> decision at this point, or is more information required?  Do you want
> me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some if
> so), or find out any more information before deciding?

Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>

> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
> > volumes. Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular items?
> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
> > accommodate us.
>
> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item might be.
>
> > In any case, where do we go from here? Is someone able to make a
> > decision at this point, or is more information required? Do you want
> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some if
> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
>
> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
>
> --
> Dave Page
> EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com
>

*ping*

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
>> > volumes.  Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular items?
>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
>> > accommodate us.
>>
>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item might
>> be.
>>
>> > In any case, where do we go from here?  Is someone able to make a
>> > decision at this point, or is more information required?  Do you want
>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some if
>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
>>
>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
>
> *ping*
>

OK to go ahead Magnus?

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
>>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
>>> > volumes.  Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular items?
>>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
>>> > accommodate us.
>>>
>>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item might
>>> be.
>>>
>>> > In any case, where do we go from here?  Is someone able to make a
>>> > decision at this point, or is more information required?  Do you want
>>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some if
>>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
>>>
>>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
>>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
>>
>> *ping*
>>
>
> OK to go ahead Magnus?

Sounds like a go for me.

A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible to
create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case, it
seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can someone
confirm that this would be the way to do it?

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>

> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> wrote:
> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
> >>> > volumes. Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular items?
> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
> >>> > accommodate us.
> >>>
> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item might
> >>> be.
> >>>
> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here? Is someone able to make a
> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required? Do you want
> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some
> if
> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
> >>>
> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
> >>
> >> *ping*
> >>
> >
> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
>
> Sounds like a go for me.
>
> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible to
> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case, it
> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can someone
> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
>
>
I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt. One was to see if we could
get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates who offer
discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if there is
any way of managing a shop with more than one account. If they can't move
on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a single
account.

Thom

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 15:13, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
>> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
>> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
>> >>> > volumes.  Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular
>> >>> > items?
>> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able to
>> >>> > accommodate us.
>> >>>
>> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item
>> >>> might
>> >>> be.
>> >>>
>> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here?  Is someone able to make a
>> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required?  Do you
>> >>> > want
>> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest some
>> >>> > if
>> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
>> >>>
>> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
>> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
>> >>
>> >> *ping*
>> >>
>> >
>> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
>>
>> Sounds like a go for me.
>>
>> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
>> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible to
>> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case, it
>> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
>> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
>> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can someone
>> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
>>
>
> I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt.  One was to see if we could
> get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates who offer
> discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if there is
> any way of managing a shop with more than one account.  If they can't move
> on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a single
> account.

Nope, not really. It's just easier to delegate and remove delegations
if they're off separate accounts, but it's certainly not a
dealbreaker.

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>

> On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 15:13, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> >> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> wrote:
> >> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> >> >>> wrote:
> >> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back saying
> >> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
> >> >>> > volumes. Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular
> >> >>> > items?
> >> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able
> to
> >> >>> > accommodate us.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item
> >> >>> might
> >> >>> be.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here? Is someone able to make a
> >> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required? Do you
> >> >>> > want
> >> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest
> some
> >> >>> > if
> >> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to me
> >> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
> >> >>
> >> >> *ping*
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
> >>
> >> Sounds like a go for me.
> >>
> >> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
> >> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible to
> >> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case, it
> >> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
> >> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
> >> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can someone
> >> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
> >>
> >
> > I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt. One was to see if we
> could
> > get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates who
> offer
> > discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if there
> is
> > any way of managing a shop with more than one account. If they can't
> move
> > on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a
> single
> > account.
>
> Nope, not really. It's just easier to delegate and remove delegations
> if they're off separate accounts, but it's certainly not a
> dealbreaker.
>
>
Okay, their email didn't answer my question so gave them a call and
explained that we'd want multiple logins to manage a single shop, but they
said it didn't work like that. Only 1 account per shop, but multiple shops
per account (not what we want). They made it clear that if you had several
people managing the shop, you would have to share the account details round.

As for the discount, they said the only discount available is a 5% discount
off the base price if booked through 1&1. This might not be a good idea
even if we did this as it could link the account to a 1&1 account in some
way.

Regards

Thom

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 12:49, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 15:13, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
>> >> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
>> >> >>> wrote:
>> >> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back
>> >> >>> > saying
>> >> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on anticipated
>> >> >>> > volumes.  Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular
>> >> >>> > items?
>> >> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be able
>> >> >>> > to
>> >> >>> > accommodate us.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item
>> >> >>> might
>> >> >>> be.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here?  Is someone able to make a
>> >> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required?  Do you
>> >> >>> > want
>> >> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest
>> >> >>> > some
>> >> >>> > if
>> >> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to
>> >> >>> me
>> >> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> *ping*
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
>> >>
>> >> Sounds like a go for me.
>> >>
>> >> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
>> >> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible to
>> >> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case, it
>> >> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
>> >> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
>> >> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can someone
>> >> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
>> >>
>> >
>> > I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt.  One was to see if we
>> > could
>> > get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates who
>> > offer
>> > discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if there
>> > is
>> > any way of managing a shop with more than one account.  If they can't
>> > move
>> > on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a
>> > single
>> > account.
>>
>> Nope, not really. It's just easier to delegate and remove delegations
>> if they're off separate accounts, but it's certainly not a
>> dealbreaker.
>>
>
> Okay, their email didn't answer my question so gave them a call and
> explained that we'd want multiple logins to manage a single shop, but they
> said it didn't work like that.  Only 1 account per shop, but multiple shops
> per account (not what we want).  They made it clear that if you had several
> people managing the shop, you would have to share the account details round.

Fair enough, so we'll do it that way.

> As for the discount, they said the only discount available is a 5% discount
> off the base price if booked through 1&1.  This might not be a good idea
> even if we did this as it could link the account to a 1&1 account in some
> way.

Enlighten me, what does it mean to be "booked through 1&1"? :-)

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/25 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>

> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 12:49, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
> >>
> >> On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 15:13, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> >> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> >> >> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown <
> thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> >> >> >>> wrote:
> >> >> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back
> >> >> >>> > saying
> >> >> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on
> anticipated
> >> >> >>> > volumes. Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular
> >> >> >>> > items?
> >> >> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be
> able
> >> >> >>> > to
> >> >> >>> > accommodate us.
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an item
> >> >> >>> might
> >> >> >>> be.
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here? Is someone able to make
> a
> >> >> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required? Do
> you
> >> >> >>> > want
> >> >> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest
> >> >> >>> > some
> >> >> >>> > if
> >> >> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems to
> >> >> >>> me
> >> >> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> *ping*
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
> >> >>
> >> >> Sounds like a go for me.
> >> >>
> >> >> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
> >> >> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible to
> >> >> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case, it
> >> >> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
> >> >> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
> >> >> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can
> someone
> >> >> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt. One was to see if we
> >> > could
> >> > get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates who
> >> > offer
> >> > discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if
> there
> >> > is
> >> > any way of managing a shop with more than one account. If they can't
> >> > move
> >> > on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a
> >> > single
> >> > account.
> >>
> >> Nope, not really. It's just easier to delegate and remove delegations
> >> if they're off separate accounts, but it's certainly not a
> >> dealbreaker.
> >>
> >
> > Okay, their email didn't answer my question so gave them a call and
> > explained that we'd want multiple logins to manage a single shop, but
> they
> > said it didn't work like that. Only 1 account per shop, but multiple
> shops
> > per account (not what we want). They made it clear that if you had
> several
> > people managing the shop, you would have to share the account details
> round.
>
> Fair enough, so we'll do it that way.
>
>
> > As for the discount, they said the only discount available is a 5%
> discount
> > off the base price if booked through 1&1. This might not be a good idea
> > even if we did this as it could link the account to a 1&1 account in some
> > way.
>
> Enlighten me, what does it mean to be "booked through 1&1"? :-)
>
>
1&1 customers (1&1 is a hosting company) have a link in their administration
control panel which links to Spreadshirt with a discount applied.

Thom

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 13:01, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/25 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 12:49, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>> >>
>> >> On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 15:13, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
>> >> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
>> >> >> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown
>> >> >> >>> <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
>> >> >> >>> wrote:
>> >> >> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back
>> >> >> >>> > saying
>> >> >> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on
>> >> >> >>> > anticipated
>> >> >> >>> > volumes.  Is there a way for us to gauge demand for particular
>> >> >> >>> > items?
>> >> >> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be
>> >> >> >>> > able
>> >> >> >>> > to
>> >> >> >>> > accommodate us.
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an
>> >> >> >>> item
>> >> >> >>> might
>> >> >> >>> be.
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here?  Is someone able to
>> >> >> >>> > make a
>> >> >> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required?  Do
>> >> >> >>> > you
>> >> >> >>> > want
>> >> >> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please suggest
>> >> >> >>> > some
>> >> >> >>> > if
>> >> >> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
>> >> >> >>>
>> >> >> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems
>> >> >> >>> to
>> >> >> >>> me
>> >> >> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone disagree?
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> *ping*
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Sounds like a go for me.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
>> >> >> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case,
>> >> >> it
>> >> >> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
>> >> >> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
>> >> >> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can
>> >> >> someone
>> >> >> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt.  One was to see if we
>> >> > could
>> >> > get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates
>> >> > who
>> >> > offer
>> >> > discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if
>> >> > there
>> >> > is
>> >> > any way of managing a shop with more than one account.  If they can't
>> >> > move
>> >> > on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a
>> >> > single
>> >> > account.
>> >>
>> >> Nope, not really. It's just easier to delegate and remove delegations
>> >> if they're off separate accounts, but it's certainly not a
>> >> dealbreaker.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Okay, their email didn't answer my question so gave them a call and
>> > explained that we'd want multiple logins to manage a single shop, but
>> > they
>> > said it didn't work like that.  Only 1 account per shop, but multiple
>> > shops
>> > per account (not what we want).  They made it clear that if you had
>> > several
>> > people managing the shop, you would have to share the account details
>> > round.
>>
>> Fair enough, so we'll do it that way.
>>
>>
>> > As for the discount, they said the only discount available is a 5%
>> > discount
>> > off the base price if booked through 1&1.  This might not be a good idea
>> > even if we did this as it could link the account to a 1&1 account in
>> > some
>> > way.
>>
>> Enlighten me, what does it mean to be "booked through 1&1"? :-)
>>
>
> 1&1 customers (1&1 is a hosting company) have a link in their administration
> control panel which links to Spreadshirt with a discount applied.

Ah, I see. Yeah, I don't think we want to get locked into something like that.

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/25 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>

> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 13:01, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > 2009/11/25 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 12:49, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> >> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 15:13, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> wrote:
> >> >> > 2009/11/24 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 15:37, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
> wrote:
> >> >> >> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Thom Brown <
> thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> >> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >> >> 2009/11/17 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Thom Brown
> >> >> >> >>> <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com>
> >> >> >> >>> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>> > Okay, Spreadshirt's bulk ordering department have come back
> >> >> >> >>> > saying
> >> >> >> >>> > they can make exceptions to their rules depending on
> >> >> >> >>> > anticipated
> >> >> >> >>> > volumes. Is there a way for us to gauge demand for
> particular
> >> >> >> >>> > items?
> >> >> >> >>> > If we knew certain items would sell well, I'm sure they'd be
> >> >> >> >>> > able
> >> >> >> >>> > to
> >> >> >> >>> > accommodate us.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> I don't think we have any real way of telling how popular an
> >> >> >> >>> item
> >> >> >> >>> might
> >> >> >> >>> be.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> > In any case, where do we go from here? Is someone able to
> >> >> >> >>> > make a
> >> >> >> >>> > decision at this point, or is more information required? Do
> >> >> >> >>> > you
> >> >> >> >>> > want
> >> >> >> >>> > me to look into more online stores for options (please
> suggest
> >> >> >> >>> > some
> >> >> >> >>> > if
> >> >> >> >>> > so), or find out any more information before deciding?
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Well, aside from the couple of items they don't have, it seems
> >> >> >> >>> to
> >> >> >> >>> me
> >> >> >> >>> like Spreadshirt offer the best option for us. Anyone
> disagree?
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> *ping*
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > OK to go ahead Magnus?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Sounds like a go for me.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> A quick check makes it look like we need to create a single pgeu
> >> >> >> account with them, to run the store from. As in, it's not possible
> >> >> >> to
> >> >> >> create a store and have multiple accounts manage it. In that case,
> >> >> >> it
> >> >> >> seems like we should create an @postgresql.eu address for it, and
> >> >> >> register that, from the beginning - and then just hand out the
> >> >> >> password to someone interested in doing the grunt work :-) Can
> >> >> >> someone
> >> >> >> confirm that this would be the way to do it?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I've fired off a couple emails to Spreadshirt. One was to see if
> we
> >> >> > could
> >> >> > get a discount for choosing them (as there appear to be affiliates
> >> >> > who
> >> >> > offer
> >> >> > discounts for joining Spreadshirt anyway) and the other to see if
> >> >> > there
> >> >> > is
> >> >> > any way of managing a shop with more than one account. If they
> can't
> >> >> > move
> >> >> > on that 2nd one, I can't see a problem with it being managed from a
> >> >> > single
> >> >> > account.
> >> >>
> >> >> Nope, not really. It's just easier to delegate and remove delegations
> >> >> if they're off separate accounts, but it's certainly not a
> >> >> dealbreaker.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Okay, their email didn't answer my question so gave them a call and
> >> > explained that we'd want multiple logins to manage a single shop, but
> >> > they
> >> > said it didn't work like that. Only 1 account per shop, but multiple
> >> > shops
> >> > per account (not what we want). They made it clear that if you had
> >> > several
> >> > people managing the shop, you would have to share the account details
> >> > round.
> >>
> >> Fair enough, so we'll do it that way.
> >>
> >>
> >> > As for the discount, they said the only discount available is a 5%
> >> > discount
> >> > off the base price if booked through 1&1. This might not be a good
> idea
> >> > even if we did this as it could link the account to a 1&1 account in
> >> > some
> >> > way.
> >>
> >> Enlighten me, what does it mean to be "booked through 1&1"? :-)
> >>
> >
> > 1&1 customers (1&1 is a hosting company) have a link in their
> administration
> > control panel which links to Spreadshirt with a discount applied.
>
> Ah, I see. Yeah, I don't think we want to get locked into something like
> that.
>
>
So now I imagine we need someone to set up the store and link it to
PostgreSQL Europe's bank account, someone to co-ordinate designs (or at
least come up with a few to put on there, maybe a wiki page with ideas for
designs including posted image examples) and someone to subsequently make
this available on the European site. There also needs to be a decision on
item pricing and what items to make available. How's this going to work?
Anything else you want me to do? And is this mailing list still an
appropriate forum for these discussions?

Cheers

Thom

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:

> So now I imagine we need someone to set up the store and link it to
> PostgreSQL Europe's bank account,

I imagine that will need to be Magnus or JPA - at least to get the
account open and linked to the bank.

> someone to co-ordinate designs (or at
> least come up with a few to put on there, maybe a wiki page with ideas for
> designs including posted image examples) and someone to subsequently make
> this available on the European site. There also needs to be a decision on
> item pricing and what items to make available.  How's this going to work?
> Anything else you want me to do?  And is this mailing list still an
> appropriate forum for these discussions?

I think this is an appropriate place. Of course, anything obviously
private or confidential can be conducted off-list (for example, if it
pertains to bank accounts, or queries from purchasers).

Are you interested in sticking with the project and starting work on
some product ideas etc?

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 01:58:15PM +0000, Thom Brown wrote:
>
> So now I imagine we need someone to set up the store and link it to
> PostgreSQL Europe's bank account, someone to co-ordinate designs (or at
> least come up with a few to put on there, maybe a wiki page with ideas for
> designs including posted image examples) and someone to subsequently make
> this available on the European site.

You just volunteered? ;-)
No, i would be happy if you can coordinate this.

> There also needs to be a decision on item pricing and what items to
> make available. How's this going to work?

I think, we first need to know the purchace price.

> And is this mailing list still an appropriate forum for these
> discussions?

According to my question¹ earlier this months: the right place is
-advocacy ... i'm not really sure if this decision stands if we flood
the mailinglist with many mails ;-)

Kind regards

1:
http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-www/2009-11/msg00023.php

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 2:11 PM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:

>> And is this mailing list still an appropriate forum for these
>> discussions?
>
> According to my question¹ earlier this months: the right place is
> -advocacy

Not for a store aimed squarely at European users.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 02:13:14PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 2:11 PM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>
> >> And is this mailing list still an appropriate forum for these
> >> discussions?
> >
> > According to my question¹ earlier this months: the right place is
> > -advocacy
>
> Not for a store aimed squarely at European users.

Look, that was all noted in my mail and my intention was to get a new
mailinglist for merchandising. This did not happen so we have to find a
place for the discussion(s).

Kind regards

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project

2009/11/26 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>

>
> Are you interested in sticking with the project and starting work on
> some product ideas etc?
>
>
2009/11/26 Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de>

> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 01:58:15PM +0000, Thom Brown wrote:
> >
> > So now I imagine we need someone to set up the store and link it to
> > PostgreSQL Europe's bank account, someone to co-ordinate designs (or at
> > least come up with a few to put on there, maybe a wiki page with ideas
> for
> > designs including posted image examples) and someone to subsequently make
> > this available on the European site.
>
> You just volunteered? ;-)
> No, i would be happy if you can coordinate this.
>
>
Sure, I'd be happy to help out with this in any way I can. Just making sure
there aren't areas better covered by particular individuals. But at some
point someone with appropriate access will need to place the online shop on
postgresql.eu.

I'll try to come up with something for design ideas on the wiki this
evening.

Thom

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 02:13:14PM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 2:11 PM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>>
>> >> And is this mailing list still an appropriate forum for these
>> >> discussions?
>> >
>> > According to my question¹ earlier this months: the right place is
>> > -advocacy
>>
>> Not for a store aimed squarely at European users.
>
> Look, that was all noted in my mail and my intention was to get a new
> mailinglist for merchandising. This did not happen so we have to find a
> place for the discussion(s).

Maybe - if discussion becomes such that we need to seperate it from a
more general list.

Either way, the global advocacy list is not the place for working
discussion of Europe-specific merchandising.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 15:23, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> 2009/11/26 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
>>
>> Are you interested in sticking with the project and starting work on
>> some product ideas etc?
>>
>
> 2009/11/26 Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 01:58:15PM +0000, Thom Brown wrote:
>> >
>> > So now I imagine we need someone to set up the store and link it to
>> > PostgreSQL Europe's bank account, someone to co-ordinate designs (or at
>> > least come up with a few to put on there, maybe a wiki page with ideas
>> > for
>> > designs including posted image examples) and someone to subsequently
>> > make
>> > this available on the European site.
>>
>> You just volunteered? ;-)
>> No, i would be happy if you can coordinate this.
>>
>
> Sure, I'd be happy to help out with this in any way I can.  Just making sure
> there aren't areas better covered by particular individuals.  But at some
> point someone with appropriate access will need to place the online shop on
> postgresql.eu.

We definitely appreciate you helping out with this.

I'll Find The Time (TM) to set up a mail alias for it, and an account
with spreadshirt in the name of it, and then provide you with the
details needed to get started on it :-)

If you have one, please email me your PGP key so I can send you the
password once it's done at least a little bit secure :-)

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

2009/11/26 Magnus Hagander <magnus(at)hagander(dot)net>

> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 15:23, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > 2009/11/26 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>
> >>
> >> Are you interested in sticking with the project and starting work on
> >> some product ideas etc?
> >>
> >
> > 2009/11/26 Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 01:58:15PM +0000, Thom Brown wrote:
> >> >
> >> > So now I imagine we need someone to set up the store and link it to
> >> > PostgreSQL Europe's bank account, someone to co-ordinate designs (or
> at
> >> > least come up with a few to put on there, maybe a wiki page with ideas
> >> > for
> >> > designs including posted image examples) and someone to subsequently
> >> > make
> >> > this available on the European site.
> >>
> >> You just volunteered? ;-)
> >> No, i would be happy if you can coordinate this.
> >>
> >
> > Sure, I'd be happy to help out with this in any way I can. Just making
> sure
> > there aren't areas better covered by particular individuals. But at some
> > point someone with appropriate access will need to place the online shop
> on
> > postgresql.eu.
>
> We definitely appreciate you helping out with this.
>
> I'll Find The Time (TM) to set up a mail alias for it, and an account
> with spreadshirt in the name of it, and then provide you with the
> details needed to get started on it :-)
>
> If you have one, please email me your PGP key so I can send you the
> password once it's done at least a little bit secure :-)
>
>
I'm no designer, but I've added some initial ideas to the wiki:
http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise#Designs

Thom

On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 9:21 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> I'm no designer, but I've added some initial ideas to the wiki:
> http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise#Designs

Oooh, shiny :-)

Few thoughts:

- Using the blue elephant logo on a blue shirt is a recipe for
disaster, if the shades of blue don't match well (and it's likely they
won't). I'd use the white outline elephant on most coloured shirts in
fact (I'll see if I can find the graphics I produced for the black UK
conference shirts for you).

- Personally I prefer a more subtle logo/tagline on the breast fo the
shirt, rather than a huge one across it.

- On the sweatshirts, I like the sleeves and the tagline across the
back (though that has lost a couple of qualifying words). It could
perhaps use 'PostgreSQL' near it so people don't have to look at a
sleeve or the front to understand what the shirt is about.

- Like the footy shirt idea :-)

- Wot no:

BEGIN;
SELECT PostgreSQL();
COMMIT;

mug? :-)

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

2009/11/27 Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org>

> On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 9:21 PM, Thom Brown <thombrown(at)gmail(dot)com> wrote:
> > I'm no designer, but I've added some initial ideas to the wiki:
> > http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise#Designs
>
> Oooh, shiny :-)
>
> Few thoughts:
>
> - Using the blue elephant logo on a blue shirt is a recipe for
> disaster, if the shades of blue don't match well (and it's likely they
> won't). I'd use the white outline elephant on most coloured shirts in
> fact (I'll see if I can find the graphics I produced for the black UK
> conference shirts for you).
>
> - Personally I prefer a more subtle logo/tagline on the breast fo the
> shirt, rather than a huge one across it.
>
> - On the sweatshirts, I like the sleeves and the tagline across the
> back (though that has lost a couple of qualifying words). It could
> perhaps use 'PostgreSQL' near it so people don't have to look at a
> sleeve or the front to understand what the shirt is about.
>
> - Like the footy shirt idea :-)
>
> - Wot no:
>
> BEGIN;
> SELECT PostgreSQL();
> COMMIT;
>
> mug? :-)
>
> --
>
>
>
D'oh! I've just noticed I didn't put the "open source" in "The world's most
advanced open source database"... but you get the idea.

Yeah, the blue elephant on blue would look a bit crap. That's easy to fix.
Select by colour, select the white, invert selection, delete. Nice white
outline. :)

As for using a small subtle logo, the image doesn't scale well on their
design tool, so it would look like a glitch, but I agree. Big logos look
rubbish generally.

These are mainly just ideas though which obviously need refining and
fleshing out a bit more. I'll try to get more design-minded folk I know to
come up with something too.

As for your SQL command... pedantry will inevitably ensue: PostgreSQL isn't
case-sensitive, and since it's only 1 command you wouldn't need a separate
transaction for it ;) But seriously, yes we can use that too.

However, it is disappointing they don't do many non-clothing items. A lot
of the ones they do offer are pointless, like dog scarfs and a bandanas.
Maybe if I whine at them enough they'll add more to their list.

Thom

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 09:05:53AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>
> - Wot no:
>
> BEGIN;
> SELECT PostgreSQL();
> COMMIT;
>
> mug? :-)

Already working on this.

Bye

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:01 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 09:05:53AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>>
>> - Wot no:
>>
>> BEGIN;
>> SELECT PostgreSQL();
>> COMMIT;
>>
>> mug? :-)
>
> Already working on this.

:-)

For the store, or for our own conference stock?

I wonder if we should make a concerted effort to offer different items
online, vs. at conferences, thus giving people more reason to buy from
both sources.

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:12:54AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:01 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
> > On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 09:05:53AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
> >>
> >> - Wot no:
> >>
> >> BEGIN;
> >> SELECT PostgreSQL();
> >> COMMIT;
> >>
> >> mug? :-)
> >
> > Already working on this.
>
> :-)
>
> For the store, or for our own conference stock?

Actually for conferences. FOSDEM is on the radar.

> I wonder if we should make a concerted effort to offer different items
> online, vs. at conferences, thus giving people more reason to buy from
> both sources.

Why not?

Bye

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project

Thom Brown skrev:
>
> I'm no designer, but I've added some initial ideas to the wiki:
> http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise#Designs

Just FYI, I believe spreadshirt require logos and designs to be uploaded
in some sort of vector graphics format, for most of their printing
methods. Hopefully that shouldn't be a problem

--
Tommy Gildseth

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:13 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:

>> I wonder if we should make a concerted effort to offer different items
>> online, vs. at conferences, thus giving people more reason to buy from
>> both sources.
>
> Why not?

Dunno - I like the idea, but then I wrote it :-)

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:14:57AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:13 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>
> >> I wonder if we should make a concerted effort to offer different items
> >> online, vs. at conferences, thus giving people more reason to buy from
> >> both sources.
> >
> > Why not?
>
> Dunno - I like the idea, but then I wrote it :-)

*hrhr* So, what's wrong with your idea? I like it too.

Bye

--
Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum
German PostgreSQL User Group
European PostgreSQL User Group - Board of Directors
Volunteer Regional Contact, Germany - PostgreSQL Project

2009/11/27 Tommy Gildseth <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no>

> Thom Brown skrev:
>
>
>> I'm no designer, but I've added some initial ideas to the wiki:
>> http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise#Designs
>>
>
>
> Just FYI, I believe spreadshirt require logos and designs to be uploaded in
> some sort of vector graphics format, for most of their printing methods.
> Hopefully that shouldn't be a problem
>
> --
> Tommy Gildseth
>
>
Spreadshirt only allow png, jpg, bmp or gif files (at least according to
their design app), which is a shame as I'd prefer to use svg or eps. They
limit the resolution to 3000x3000, so I just took the svg and blew it up to
have it's longest dimension to be 3000 pixels. ;)

Thom

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:16 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:14:57AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:13 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>>
>> >> I wonder if we should make a concerted effort to offer different items
>> >> online, vs. at conferences, thus giving people more reason to buy from
>> >> both sources.
>> >
>> > Why not?
>>
>> Dunno - I like the idea, but then I wrote it :-)
>
> *hrhr* So, what's wrong with your idea? I like it too.

Good, then we're in agreement :-)

--
Dave Page
EnterpriseDB UK: http://www.enterprisedb.com

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 11:20, Dave Page <dpage(at)pgadmin(dot)org> wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:16 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:14:57AM +0000, Dave Page wrote:
>>> On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 10:13 AM, Andreas 'ads' Scherbaum <ads(at)pgug(dot)de> wrote:
>>>
>>> >> I wonder if we should make a concerted effort to offer different items
>>> >> online, vs. at conferences, thus giving people more reason to buy from
>>> >> both sources.
>>> >
>>> > Why not?
>>>
>>> Dunno - I like the idea, but then I wrote it :-)
>>
>> *hrhr* So, what's wrong with your idea? I like it too.
>
> Good, then we're in agreement :-)

So, +1 just so I've said it :-)

--
Magnus Hagander
Me: http://www.hagander.net/
Work: http://www.redpill-linpro.com/

Thom Brown skrev:
> 2009/11/27 Tommy Gildseth <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no
> Just FYI, I believe spreadshirt require logos and designs to be
> uploaded in some sort of vector graphics format, for most of their
> printing methods. Hopefully that shouldn't be a problem
>
> Spreadshirt only allow png, jpg, bmp or gif files (at least according to
> their design app), which is a shame as I'd prefer to use svg or eps.
> They limit the resolution to 3000x3000, so I just took the svg and blew
> it up to have it's longest dimension to be 3000 pixels. ;)

No, they have different printing techniques which require different
source files:
http://www.spreadshirt.net/en/GB/Service/Help-1328/categoryId/325/articleId/34

Plot printing which requires that you upload your design in a vector
format, gives better quality prints than digital printing, which is used
when you upload your designs in a pixel graphics format.

--
Tommy Gildseth

2009/11/27 Tommy Gildseth <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no>

> Thom Brown skrev:
>
>> 2009/11/27 Tommy Gildseth <tommy(dot)gildseth(at)usit(dot)uio(dot)no Just FYI, I
>> believe spreadshirt require logos and designs to be
>>
>> uploaded in some sort of vector graphics format, for most of their
>> printing methods. Hopefully that shouldn't be a problem
>>
>> Spreadshirt only allow png, jpg, bmp or gif files (at least according to
>> their design app), which is a shame as I'd prefer to use svg or eps. They
>> limit the resolution to 3000x3000, so I just took the svg and blew it up to
>> have it's longest dimension to be 3000 pixels. ;)
>>
>
> No, they have different printing techniques which require different source
> files:
>
> http://www.spreadshirt.net/en/GB/Service/Help-1328/categoryId/325/articleId/34
>
> Plot printing which requires that you upload your design in a vector
> format, gives better quality prints than digital printing, which is used
> when you upload your designs in a pixel graphics format.
>
> --
> Tommy Gildseth
>

I can see what you mean by looking at that help page, but I still don't see
any option available when trying to upload a picture. I've tried out all
printing technique options, and it still restricts me to the same 4 raster
formats. It also doesn't show up any svg or eps files in the file explorer,
only png, jpg, gif or bmp. :( I'm not sure how to upload vector graphics
using their designer application.

Thom

>
> I'm no designer, but I've added some initial ideas to the wiki:
> http://wiki.postgresql.eu/wiki/Merchandise#Designs
>
> Thom
>

Hi Thom,

If i can give a modest piece of advice, i think you'd better not use the
3-colour logo ( black-white-blue ), but use instead the monochrome logo.

First because it's cheaper to print only one color.

Second, imho you will have difficulties finding the exact same blue
that's in the 3 colour logo inside the spreadshirt limited palette.
Ifor instance, the shirt designs you've submitted, the blue on the shirt
is not the same that the blue on the logo, it seems awkward to me.

Third, the monochrome logo has no filling, it's just the outline of the
elephant head. Thus it has this transparent effect that makes it look
more "integrated" into the shirt

All those thoughts came to me while doing the PGDay.eu bags, which look
like that :

http://nawak.taadeem.net/BAT_postgresql-3.jpg

You can find the one-color logo (white or blue) in SVG format here :

http://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/Logo#Single-color_elephant

That being said you've done a nice job, i like the football shirt. the
hoodie's pretty cool too, maybe even cooler in black and white...

Hope this helps :)

--
damien clochard